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Subject Topic: full power Mauser 8mm ammo loads Post ReplyPost New Topic
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preventec47
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Joined: December 14 2007
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Posted: December 25 2007 at 1:10am | IP Logged Quote preventec47

Many may not know that for several decades the Lawyers
have forced the us ammo makers to download the awesome
Mauser 8mm JS round to nearly the power of the 30-30.

I have been searching for weeks for load recipes that
duplicate the German Military specs and also the
current European specs for the cartridge. I had
to go to 40 yr old reload manuals and todays Hodgdon
powder reload manual

Is anyone here reloading for 8mm Mausers ? contact
me please.

published Euro Spec Mauser 8x57mm JS Load Data

Very close to original Euro Spec 8mm JS load data
to match or exceed orig military spec 154gr @ 2880fps
and current Sellier & Belliot 196gr @ 2592fps


"Lyman 43rd manual" 1964: IMR4895 powder max loads
-----------------------------
150gr..54gr..2920fps
170gr..51gr..2695fps
225gr..49gr..2410fps

"Speer 7 manual" 1966: IMR4895 powder max loads
-----------------------------
150gr..54gr..2864fps
170gr..51gr..2704fps
225gr..49gr..2452fps


Online load data showing up to 49,800 cup for 8mm Mauser
using H4895 powder below: (max loads)

http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp
---------------------------------------
125gr..53.5gr..3208fps...49,400cup
150gr..51.0gr..2987fps...49,500cup
175gr..49.4gr..2763fps...48,300cup
200gr..45.4gr..2539fps...49,200cup
220gr..45.2gr..2420fps...48,800cup
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richhodg66
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Joined: December 13 2006
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1871
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Posted: December 25 2007 at 5:31am | IP Logged Quote richhodg66

I've never loaded for 8x57, but I'm sure I'll have one someday so I'm interested. My briother had a 49 FN that he loaded for, I'll ask him what he used when I talk to him again.

What exactly was the German military load? I'm a little curious. It's a great cartridge and was the inspiration for our beloved .30-'06.
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preventec47
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Posted: December 25 2007 at 5:55am | IP Logged Quote preventec47

QUOTE FROM NORMA website re 8x57mm Mauser
------------------
ORIGINAL MILITARY SPECS 8x57mm
In 1905, Germany increased working pressure of this cartridge and switched from a 226-grain, 0.318-inch, round-nose bullet (2095-fps) to a 154-grain, 0.323-inch, spitzer bullet (2880-fps) The reason behind the increase in bullet diameter was that the grooves of all existing military 8x57 J barrels were deepened, to extend useful barrel life; all new barrels were specified with the deeper grooves; bore diameter was unaltered.
The "S" in the designation stands for "Spitzer" and also indicates that the bore was either originally made for, or was altered for, 0.323-inch bullets. It is extremely rare to find a sporting rifle chambered and barreled for the original 8x57 J (0.318-inch groove).

quoted from elsewhere regarding the European CIP specs.......
"The 7.92x57mm J denotes the original cartridge with a
.318-inch diameter bullet and moderate pressure limits
Piezo CIP Pmax 241.317 MPa [35,000 psi]) or 37,500 CUP

The 7.92x57mm JS designates the later, higher pressure
(Piezo CIP Pmax = 390.0 MPa) (58,200psi) cartridge with a
.323-inch bullet. The letter 'J' is actually not a 'J' at all, but an 'I' for 'infanterie'. However, at the time the German printers were using a typeface in which the letter 'I' looked like the modern 'J'. The letter 'S' stands for Spitzgeschos (pointed bullet), and the English word "spitzer" is derived from this German term.

The American standardizing body for sporting cartridges SAAMI designates this latter cartridge as the 8mm Mauser, also known as 8x57mm JS.
However, the USA SAAMI pressure limitation for this cartridge is taken from the older 7.92x57 I and is limited to (Piezo SAAMI Pmax = 241,317 MPa [35,000 psi]) or 37,500 CUP. This is done for safety, in case the .323-inch bullet is fired in an 'I' bore (.318 inch) rifle. USA ammo manufacturers load to the lower pressure limit for 'I' bore cartridges."



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Leftoverdj
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Posted: December 25 2007 at 8:08am | IP Logged Quote Leftoverdj

Besides the possible difference in bore size, there are a good many rifles of questionable strength chambered for 8x57. Not only are there the Commission rifles to be considered, but in the course of two world wars, the Germans converted a variety of obsolete or captured rifles to 8x57 for issue to auxilary forces. Additionally, there is the issue of Chinese copies of the Mauser 98, sometimes with forged German marking, but of very dubious quality.

I don't blame the manuals a bit for the low pressure limits in this case. It would be nice if they printed two sets of data as is done for some other cartridges but the border line is not clear. The only 8x57 I ever reloaded for and shot extensively was a Hakim. It may well have been strong enough for 50,000 CUP loads, but I settled for something well under that although a bit hotter than most American manual loads.
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JimP.
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Joined: December 17 2006
Location: Maiden, NC
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Posted: December 25 2007 at 8:17am | IP Logged Quote JimP.

I have been loading for years for a Mod 98 mauser made during WWII and use the two bullets available from Speer and havent seen the need yet to try more as I still havent gone through the original rounds I loaded 15 years ago, they still shoot very well, the two bullets are the:
150 spitzer hot cor bullet with 50.0 gr of AA2015 for 2956 fps, 53.0 gr of RL-15 for 2779 fps and 54.0 gr of W748 for 2808 fps...I worked up carefully for these loads and they are safe in my rifle, use caution, work these loads up in yours...the second bullet is the 200 Speer soft point hot cor bullet, might be a semispitzer, cant remember, but the load I started with shot so well I didnt go any further with the load and it is 53.0 grs of W760 for 2379 fps, this isnt a max load but shoots very well in my rifle, mostly I hunted with the 150 gr bullet and it slays deer very well, and always punched through the other side....hope this helps...JimP.
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