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LAH
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Posted: August 30 2017 at 7:20pm | IP Logged Quote LAH

The Ruger I shoot most is the hardest handgun I've ever
tried to use. The S&W K & N frames are a natural. The
grip is easy to repeat but the standard Blackhawk is a
bear to repeat. Add to that the lock time & torque of the
hammer turning loose & I have a horrible time holding the
sight picture.

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Old Ranger
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Posted: August 30 2017 at 7:54pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Lynn, I can use my Bounty Hunter all day long and keep em in right tiny little groups dead center. The Colt copy? Unless I rotate it about 12° to the right from my normal grip it will be left. Figured the low is from the 200gr RNFP loads hitting low on their own. But I never figured it was needing to physically twist the weapon in my hand to shoot correctly! Simply does not feel natural or right. Just feels goofy!

The Bounty Hunter, well I just snatch it from the holster and I'm ready to get busy. And I gotta do something stupid to miss! Radically different grips and the Bounty Hunter is about 10%~12% larger overall. That's gotta be a major contributing factor.

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RT58
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Posted: August 31 2017 at 6:42am | IP Logged Quote RT58

The light bullets are my guess for the low grouping. Since you shoot other weapons with no problem, I would think the shooting left issue is with the trigger finger placement or pull. You mentioned the grips and overall larger size of your Bounty Hunter and that might be why you shoot it better. With smaller handguns it's harder to not put the trigger finger in too far and to pull straight back.
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Old Ranger
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Posted: September 01 2017 at 4:13am | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Yes sir, this trigger finger placement thing has me baffled. My "normal" grip on the 1911A1 or S&W double actions are just perfect. I hold them in a comfortable position in my hand and shoot great. Same with the big Bounty Hunter. I simply pick it up and shoot straight with no issues. But with the Colt what "feels" natural and right causes everything to go left.

The "pie sectional" pistol shooting correction target says this left shooting is caused by "not enough finger on the trigger". In order to get more finger in there, I have to twist the weapon in my hand to the right from what is a normal grip to one that feels unnatural.
If I retain my natural grip and try to get more finger in the trigger it won't work. I have a good portion of the finger against the frame. Of course, when the squeeze is started the finger pressure on the frame pushes the weapon left.
I'm beginning to think that it's hopeless. Today, I will try again. I've loaded a few with the Lee 255gr RNFP and 5.8gr of good ole Red Dot. I'll try again with as much concentration as I can muster. But I'll be brutally honest here, if something doesn't give and I start shooting straight, this pretty engraved 45Colt is going up for sale or trade. I simply won't have a gun that I can't shoot!

Edit:

Further, I installed an old Williams "Guide" trigger shoe to help with trigger isolation. I'm serious. I came within inches of cocking my arm back and throwing that gun as hard as I could into the woods a couple days ago!

Edited by Old Ranger on September 01 2017 at 7:25am


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The_Shadow
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Posted: September 01 2017 at 7:22am | IP Logged Quote The_Shadow

LAH, Yes those Smith & Wesson K and N frames I have are
sweet shooters with triggers that are very
smooth...Those auto loaders with the takeup took a lot
of getting use to, then those Glocks, while not the best
feel for the trigger and grip, it was a new education to
get them to shoot well in my hands...still fun though.


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LAH
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Posted: September 01 2017 at 7:29am | IP Logged Quote LAH

The_Shadow wrote:
still fun though.


I haven't thought of throwing the little Ruger like Ranger
but I have thought of giving it a good cleaning & placing
it in retirement. At times it isn't fun.

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Old Ranger
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Posted: September 01 2017 at 7:37am | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

The 255gr came up on paper but still left! I'm done with it. My health is failing. I'm tired. And I don't care anymore. I won't keep a gun I can't use. Sorry if I sound whiny and fickle but the fact of the matter is tired of stuff that doesn't work.

I'm gonna take a break. I'll talk to y'all after a bit...
Ranger, out.

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RT58
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Posted: September 02 2017 at 6:28pm | IP Logged Quote RT58

Wade I don't see much difference in length between my Colt clones and a K frame in double action, but I'm sure our hands aren't the same so it may be enough to make a difference to you. I didn't think anyone had stubbier fingers than I do.

I used to work with a deputy that had the tip of his right index finger missing due to a farm accident as a child. He used his middle finger to pull the trigger on his pistols. I'm sure that would be tough to get used to after all these years though.
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LAH
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Posted: September 02 2017 at 6:52pm | IP Logged Quote LAH

Enjoy your time off Ranger.

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Old Ranger
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Posted: September 02 2017 at 6:54pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger



There are 20 rounds fired at the absolute dead center of this target at 15yds. Everything goes low-left. Everything. That is unacceptable. I will sell/trade/or desttroy this weapon. I simply cannot shoot it. I love the design. Yet I now hate how they shoot.
Valuable lesson. I'll keep my old k fram 38 M&P, my Bounty Hunter, and of course, my 1911A1. Everything else goes.

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Atavist
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Posted: September 02 2017 at 7:10pm | IP Logged Quote Atavist

At least you are grouping well... have you
tried different loads? With my new
cimarron I find everything groups but the
groups are all over the clock... need to
sit down and find the load that is right
for this gun and me...

I know you are a way more experienced
shooter than me but low left I think palm
heel gap which allows the gun to torque
low left ... have you tried powder puff
loads with almost no recoil?
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Old Ranger
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Posted: September 02 2017 at 7:59pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Everything goes low-left. 200gr RNFP, 255gr RNFP, 250gr conical, 225gr RN, 255gr SWC. 700fps to 900fps. Everything goes low-left.... Put it on a rest and its bullseye city. Stand on my hind legs and it all, ALL, low and left. The .357Mag mod P was the same way.

Scrappin all the SAA's except the Bounty Hunter. It shoots perfect. Dead on perfect. Freaky scary perfect. I'll take the money from selling the others and buy a 7 1/2" Bounty Hunter in .45Colt.

Just did a similar thing Thursday with two guitars I hardly ever play. Just sat in the cases for ages. Took em to a guitar shop and turned them into a brand new Artic White Fender Stratocaster. Always wanted one. Was on my bucket list too. Best part is that it plays beautifully.

So I'm taking a break from pistols and gonna play me some down home Texas Blues! See y'all!

Edited by Old Ranger on September 02 2017 at 8:11pm


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RT58
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Posted: September 04 2017 at 3:50pm | IP Logged Quote RT58

I've tried playing guitars and a few other stringed instruments, but never could get my fingers to work right.

Anyway, it's probably a grip problem, but if you correct that problem it may create an adverse issue with the way you grip the other handguns you can shoot well now. Getting one you can already shoot is probably the way to go.

Colt SAA's, and their clones, are not the greatest handgun ever made with the slow loading and unloading and the grip frame made for a T-Rex. But they do have some good points like their balance and the fact, in my opinion at least, that they are the best weapon for shooting where you are pointing.
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Old Ranger
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Posted: September 05 2017 at 8:46am | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Guess I do guitars better.

Tried one last time. Stinko! You're quite right. It's the grip. Stupid me keeps thinking I'll find it. I won't.
I'll keep the gun to remind me of how I've become a foolish old man. I'll do nothing but hip shoot it and forget about trying to aim. I'll speak of it no more as I'm quite sure y'all are tired of my complaint. Me too. I got better things to do.

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LAH
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Posted: September 05 2017 at 1:51pm | IP Logged Quote LAH

Hard to get tired of someone working on a sixgun problem.


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Old Ranger
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Posted: September 05 2017 at 3:54pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Bless ya Lynn. You're a good man, especially putting up with the likes of me!

Edit: Just to prove it's me & the grips, I went out this morning with my 1860 Army conversion. I shot a well centered 20 round group of 5" standing at 25yds. The longer and slimmer designed grips are perfect for me whereas the Navy sized grips fail me.
You may now return to your regularly scheduled programming.

Edited by Old Ranger on September 06 2017 at 8:44am


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Slick
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Posted: September 13 2017 at 8:25pm | IP Logged Quote Slick

Old Ranger wrote:
Yeah, it took most of my life to figure out that single action revolvers don't fit my hand!


Rich was right. Shoot what you're good with.


My first gun purchase was a father/son exercise when I was 12 years old. My dad matched my dollars saved towards a sweet H&R 950 and made the purchase. He turned it over to me when I left home after college.

The 960 is a nine-shot .22LR SA/DA western style revolver. It had a "plow-grip" that was much too large to feel right. When I was in the 8th grade I had a wood shop class and for a project I brought in the walnut grip and shaved off as much (towards the bottom) as I could get away with. I finished it up with a clear poly-something or other clear coat.

Next time we went shooting, I did better and noticed right away that being comfortable in my grip made a HUGE difference. Having had such good results, I decided to file the backside of that “tear-drop” front sight flat and finish with cold blue. The gun is in nickel so that original front site was a PITA to work with. I took my time and these two projects in gunsmith in my early teens had me hooked for life.

But just like you, I still learn new things all the time. I have a good friend I’ve only known for a couple of years and he’s the age of a son – if I had kids. He’s the only person I know who’s probably even more of an avid gun fan than I am. I’ve learned a couple things from him and I always pay attention to what the kid has to say.

Oh and plus +2 on Rich's advice. I would only add to that by appending, "and sell the rest".

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Posted: September 13 2017 at 8:31pm | IP Logged Quote Slick

LAH wrote:
The Ruger I shoot most is the hardest handgun I've ever tried to use.


Have you looked at a Bisley grip? I never liked the way the Super Blackhawk felt until I tried the Bisley.

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Old Ranger
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Posted: September 14 2017 at 1:57pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Decided I'm going to sell everything but the 1911A1, the scoped .30'06Spr,and the M92 357Mag levergun. Oh, and the 1932 Stevens m25 .22S,L,LR pump. Everything else must go!

Gettin' sick of guns.....

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