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M700
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Posted: October 11 2017 at 5:31pm | IP Logged Quote M700

Old Ranger wrote:
Never even seen a poly pointed bullet before. Kinda funny looking. But I hope it shoots better in my carbine. ]


You've never seen a poly tipped bullet? They've been around since the mid 1980's with Nosler's Ballistic Tip, that's only about 30 years or so....

Now made by Barnes, Nosler, Hornady, Sierra, and probably someone I'm forgetting, they typically shoot really well. Also they tend to expand readily on contact with game.

I'm a huge fan of the Nosler Ballistic Tip, which has been toughened up considerably since the introduction back in the 1980's. I use them mostly in:

25-06, 115 gr
30-06, 165 gr

Last year the 30-06 with the 165 Ballistic Tip took elk, mule deer, black bear and antelope for me. All dropped quickly after the shot, 140 yards to 338 yards.

Deer season starts this coming Saturday, and I'll be carrying my 25-06 with the 115 gr Nosler Ballistic Tips. That combo has brought me quite a few mule deer as well as a couple of pronghorn antelope.

Ya, plastic tipped bullets are a very common thing anymore and tend to perform very well at the range or in the hunting field.

One caution - the AR-15 has been known to knock the tips off during the feeding cycle!

Guy

Edited by M700 on October 11 2017 at 5:33pm
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Old Ranger
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Posted: October 11 2017 at 6:47pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Well Guy, for the past few decades I've been shootin' cast rounds and the old standards like BTSP and such. Must be gettin' like my old uncle. Figured plastic pointed bullets are a passing phase, like smokeless powder.

Edit: Just re-read your comment on the plastic tip coming off with the AR15 loading cycle. Wouldn't ya know I'd pick something like that.

Edited by Old Ranger on October 12 2017 at 4:24am


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Old Ranger
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Posted: October 11 2017 at 7:01pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Rex, I would have bought a heavier bullet, but the 60gr was all he had above 55gr. I'm trying real hard to keep patient with this but my temper has grown shorter when I hit 70. I get rowdy pretty quick these days. But I'm trying. But if I can't resolve this soon, I'm gonna drive this stubby thing into the ground and use it as a gate post. I got my old 92 357 carbine. I'm great with it.

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M700
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Posted: October 12 2017 at 6:46am | IP Logged Quote M700

I wouldn't worry a lot about the tips coming off - unless it starts happening. It sure doesn't happen all the time!

We noticed it when one agency selected Hornady TAP ammo, which had a plastic tip. I haven't ever seen it with my own AR-16 & plastic tip bullets (Nosler Ballistic Tips). Just thought I'd mention it.

Would you consider mail-order for your bullet purchases? Grafs & Midway, as well as Nosler's "Shooters Pro Shop" usually have quite a few different, heavier .22 cal bullets available. I'd think your AR-15 would shoot very well with any of the various 68 or 69 gr match bullets, probably even the 75's.

Guy
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Posted: October 12 2017 at 8:28am | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Guy, I order rounds all the time. However, since my old RCBS small base 223Rem dies were stolen long ago,I needed to replace them. A set oh Hornady American Series dies are out for delivery today. My mailman is a fellow shooter and loader. Always good to talk with.

The reason I bought local was to insure that I had rounds on hand to load.

Of interest. Yesterday, I bought two boxes of PPU 62gr FMJ factory loads. Just came in a while ago. WOW!! What a difference a 7gr increase makes! Went from a 4.5" spread with 55gr to a .23" spread with the 62gr bullet! I'd say that's conclusive evidence and proof that the 1:8 barrel on this weapon sucks with 55gr but shines with longer bullets such as the 62gr.

50 yds with 1.25x-4x-28mm scope and sandbags. The difference is obvious. Made one sight correction on the 55gr. Three with the 62gr since it's actions indicated confidence in zeroing. And yes, round #5 & #6 on the 62gr target are fighting for the same hole. Good enough for me.



Do believe since the evil 55gr nasties are gone, they will not be invited to play with my near fence post carbine.

We're all going to 62gr or so here at the stomping grounds of the Old Ranger!

Edited by Old Ranger on October 12 2017 at 8:34am


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Yeti
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Posted: October 12 2017 at 5:08pm | IP Logged Quote Yeti

You are going the right direction with 62gr+ rounds. But I suspect your
experience with the 55's was a crap bullet problem. I shoot mostly 1-8 AR's
and they will stack quality 53 & 55 grainers one on top of the other. but for
absolute accuracy I still rely on 77 grainers.

FWIW, it is not cheap but the 70gr TSX is an absolute hammer out of my AR's.

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Old Ranger
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Posted: October 13 2017 at 11:50am | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

3 different factory loads of 55gr FMJ and all stunk. Not to sound argumentative, but I believe that the weapon's barrel does not adapt well to lighter/shorter bullets.
The 62gr PPU factory loads are superb in this barrel. Two very basic loads (25gr RL15, 22gr IMR3031) with the Hornady 60gr VMax bullets were good. The 3031 load being the tighter of the two.

I am now, more than ever, convinced of the longer bullets in the fast twist bores, especially in the bore of my rifle in particular. This morning revealed that the rifle is, in fact, capable of extreme accuracy. Shot a 1.2", 3 shot group at 100yds off the sandbag with 22gr 3031 and the Hornady 60gr VMax. Can't wait to put one in a hog tomorrow night!

Edited by Old Ranger on October 13 2017 at 11:52am


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joed
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Posted: October 13 2017 at 12:04pm | IP Logged Quote joed

Wade, from experience I can tell you the 69 gr bullets will probably
amaze you.   I could not get anything under 60 gr to shoot very well
either. Makes me wonder when someone says their AR with fast
twist shoots 50/55 gr bullets fine.

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M700
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Posted: October 13 2017 at 12:58pm | IP Logged Quote M700

NICE!

Yes, the fast twist and long bullets were made for each other. So cool to see a nice group from your new Evil Black Rifle!

Regards, Guy
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Old Ranger
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Posted: October 13 2017 at 2:28pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

joed wrote:
Makes me wonder when someone says their AR with fast
twist shoots 50/55 gr bullets fine.


Joe, I think they're pulling your leg when they tell ya that! And when I can get bigger ones, I will.

Guy, those subliminal messages you sent me a while back sure did create a monster! Now I was deadly wicked with my old Armalite AR180 back 20 plus years ago, but it's been gone a long time. But today's little black rifle sure is taking on that evil aura about it....I can forsee Dead hogs.... Dead coyotes.... Splattered armadillos! All from this little carbine.

Edited by Old Ranger on October 14 2017 at 7:56am


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joed
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Posted: October 13 2017 at 2:39pm | IP Logged Quote joed

Old Ranger wrote:

Joe, I think they're pulling your leg when they tell ya that! And when I
can get bigger ones, I will.


I figured they had no clue. Like you, I couldn't get them to shoot
either.   Best group was probably twice the size of the 75 gr bullets.

Wade, I no longer reload .223, so I'll see what I have in heavy bullets.   
If any are left they're yours.

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Posted: October 13 2017 at 2:54pm | IP Logged Quote joed

This is what you need to try. Check your private messages Wade.




Edited by joed on October 13 2017 at 2:59pm


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M700
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Posted: October 13 2017 at 6:57pm | IP Logged Quote M700

That is a terrific bullet in the 5.56/223 AR-15...

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Posted: October 13 2017 at 7:10pm | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

PM sent.

My granddaughter and I both thank you for your generosity and can guarantee we'll shoot straight!

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Posted: October 21 2017 at 7:21am | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Well, the results are in, sorta. The 69gr HPBT Sierra bullets joed sent me arrived. Thanks again! Loaded up a few with IMR4320 and got busy on my range. Was doing well with the iron sights off my new fore end rest. New old school 20 round mag making bench shooting a dream. Finished the 25m zero. Was doing some very deliberate and slow fire at 100yds. The new rest I'd built was great. The rifle felt good in the hands and the light was an hour before sundown and zero wind. Perfect. Managed to get off two rounds and then it happened.

After the second shot my dogs alerted me. It was "Drunk Neighbor" approaching with his usual large tankard of booze and a Ruger American.45ACP on his side in some sort of droopy holster. I could tell by his walk he already had a load on. I knew my evening shoot was now ruined. I unloaded my weapon to remove the temptation of him trying to shoot my weapon, and also from me using it on him. (kidding folks) But the first thing he wants to do is shoot my rifle. Says he wants a 30 round mag in it and he'll show me how a SEAL shoots an AR fast! He was an E-4 machinist mate that was in the brig half his 4 year Navy career. The closest he ever got to a seal was the one on a bottle of whiskey. After an hour passes, he's outta booze, the sky's outta light, and I'm outta patience. He staggers home. I pack up my gear and go inside to clean my weapon.

The following day I go down to the target I had started with at 100yds. There were two rounds, side by side. One in the bullseye and the other just to the right of it on the same level about 3/4" away. Though just two rounds, with iron sights, that's good enough for me. Those Sierra MK bullets are dynamite!

Lessons Learned:

1. Shoot in the morning when Drunk Neighbor is at work.
2. Don't shoot on the weekend when Drunk Neighbor is home. Like a bear in the woods, he hears gunfire he's drawn to it.
3.Sierra 69gr MK shoot really well!

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M700
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Posted: October 21 2017 at 7:34am | IP Logged Quote M700

Sorry you've got the drunk neighbor to work around. Bummer.

And, glad those 69 gr SMK's worked well!

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Posted: October 21 2017 at 7:34am | IP Logged Quote joed

Good to hear they shoot good, but sorry about the neighbor.   That
would try my patience.

That's not bad for 100 yds with iron sites, I haven't tried that in years
and don't know how well I'd do.

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Posted: October 21 2017 at 8:23am | IP Logged Quote joed

Wade, I love your stories, you have a way of telling them that I have
never experienced before.

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Posted: October 23 2017 at 6:05am | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Back to this twist thing. A conversation with my buddy at the shop was interesting. When explaining my issue with 55gr and that of my granddaughter as well with a 1:9, he made the following statement:

All the 55gr FMJ bullets today are crap. None of them are any good in a 1:8 or a 1:9 barrel. Get any 55gr SP or such and they won't be scattered like the FMJ stuff. According to him, if I were to use simply any 55gr bullet other than the FMJ I'd have tight groups and wonderful performance. Maybe. I'll get a box of 55gr SP today and see.

The above statement echos that of Yeti's on the plight of the cheap 55gr bullet business. I'm not going to rush out and buy 1K of 55gr SP until I verify that this is the case with my particular weapon, but if it is functional with 55gr SP, then that would really save me coin. As it is now, 60gr plus in any configuration is doing well in my bore, but they cost a bit more as compared to from a source I have for 55grSP. We'll see I suppose.

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Posted: October 23 2017 at 8:22am | IP Logged Quote joed

Wade, you may be on to something.   The 55 gr FMJ was what I tried
and got mediocre accuracy.    

I did try some Federal 50 gr HPs and wasn't impressed with it in 1:9
and 1:7 twist.   But these were Federal Bulk packs.   They may not be
very high quality.

Not sure what else I have in .224 caliber with a soft point.   I'll have
to look and maybe try a few in my rifle.



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