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STCM(SW)
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Posted: March 21 2018 at 4:48pm | IP Logged Quote STCM(SW)

A few more 44's I have....




Edited by STCM(SW) on March 21 2018 at 7:01pm


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John Van Gelder
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Posted: March 21 2018 at 5:00pm | IP Logged Quote John Van Gelder

The 28 is the working working gun. The 27s back in the day were probably the premier .357. Fit and finish was just excellent. General Patton carried a custom 27, with the 3.5" barrel. The 27 had a lot of options, the 28 came in 4" or 6".

Probably the only other S&W that came even close to the 27 in finish was the original mod. 29s. There is a caveat here, the first .357s were not 27s, their model designation was "registered something", the 27s came along later. Those first S&W .357 guns were all hand fitted, and came with "papers"..

I have my Dad's old 29, it has a four digit serial number. I am not sure when he got it, but my brother was still in Korea then.

Edited by John Van Gelder on March 21 2018 at 5:04pm
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doghawg
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Posted: March 21 2018 at 8:07pm | IP Logged Quote doghawg

Wow! Some mighty mouth watering pictures showing up here!
My M28 has nearly 200 rounds through it and it's every bit as accurate as I hoped for. The gentleman I got it from also has a pristine M27 and a .38/44....but is not ready to part with them yet.

Randy

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REM1875
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Posted: March 21 2018 at 8:45pm | IP Logged Quote REM1875

Our 44 S&W's are Texas Wagon Train 44-40. We like them a
hell of a lot .......

But them be some mighty damned nice 44's, Master Chief

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STCM(SW)
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Posted: March 21 2018 at 10:29pm | IP Logged Quote STCM(SW)

That second one is a Texas 44-40.
The last one dates to 1923, shoots as good or better then the first one in this post.....

Edited by STCM(SW) on March 21 2018 at 10:30pm


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John Van Gelder
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Posted: March 22 2018 at 5:56am | IP Logged Quote John Van Gelder

Randy

Those .38-44 Outdoorsman models were the foundation for the .357, they were very nicely finished.
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Kosh75287
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Posted: March 22 2018 at 8:31am | IP Logged Quote Kosh75287

Master Chief, I think you need to invest more heavily in the N-Frame S&W revolvers! LOL
Beautiful guns! It's good to know that someone besides me thinks so highly of them!
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RT58
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Posted: March 22 2018 at 11:19am | IP Logged Quote RT58

STCM(SW) wrote:
That second one is a Texas 44-40.
The last one dates to 1923, shoots as good or better then the first one in this post.....

I couldn't make out the writing on the .44-40 but did notice the five inch barrel by looking at it. Did you change the grips or did you buy it that way?

The last one looks like it would feel good in the hand with that light barrel. I prefer shorter barrels but light weight, longer ones are good for range guns. You do have a nice collection.
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doghawg
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Posted: March 22 2018 at 7:47pm | IP Logged Quote doghawg

John Van Gelder wrote:
Randy

Those .38-44 Outdoorsman models were the foundation for the .357, they were very nicely finished.


John

The numbers were the 170 gr. Keith SWC at 1100 fps if memory serves....certainly no popgun.

Randy

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STCM(SW)
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Posted: March 22 2018 at 9:32pm | IP Logged Quote STCM(SW)

"I couldn't make out the writing on the .44-40 but did notice the five inch barrel by looking at it. Did you change the grips or did you buy it that way?"

I have all the original boxes and it came that way.

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REM1875
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Posted: March 23 2018 at 3:00am | IP Logged Quote REM1875

All our Texas Wagon Trail 44-40's have a different grip
than the Master Chief's


Edited by REM1875 on March 23 2018 at 3:01am


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RT58
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Posted: March 23 2018 at 7:02am | IP Logged Quote RT58

Thanks STCM, That's an interesting find.

REM1875 wrote:
All our Texas Wagon Trail 44-40's have a different grip
than the Master Chief's

I only have one, and it has the smooth Goncalo Alves target stock the standard versions were shipped with. I do like the magna stocks better than the targets on a carry gun though.



Edited by RT58 on March 23 2018 at 7:06am
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John Van Gelder
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Posted: March 23 2018 at 7:31am | IP Logged Quote John Van Gelder

Randy

The factory .38-44 loading originally was with a 158 gr, bullet loaded to just over 1100 fps.

By the end of the run the ammunition companies had reduced those to around 1050. Those old N frame guns were heavy for the .357 magnum loads by todays standards. The SAMMI upper pressure limit is listed at 35K. I found an article written by some one who had some of the original factory .357 ammunition, they sent it off to a lab for pressure testing. Some of it went as high as 46K.
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Paul B.
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Posted: March 23 2018 at 3:54pm | IP Logged Quote Paul B.

I have one box left of some of the earlier .357 Mag. loads before they
were reduced by SAAMI. They're Winchester brand and when I got
them, a guy had them at the range and was going to throw it and the
box he had left into the brass bucket. I asked if I could have them to
break them sown for the brass and he said OK. I got a box and a half
of that ammo. When I looked at them and ran my fingernail over one of
the bullets I realized what they were. When I got home, I pulled a few
bullets and the charge was 15.5 gr. +/-.1gr. of what looked like 2400
powder. My guess is a canister version of 2400 for the .357. I know that
early ammo was noted for leading barrels badly and these were no
exception. The half box I shot up and the full box is in my collection.
FWIW, it took a while to scrub the lead out of the barrel of my M28.
I can remember when the max load for the .357 Mag. was 15.0 gr. of
H2400, the H standing for Hercules who made the powder back then.
Of course A2400 is for the current Alliant version which to me seems to
be a hair faster burning. I could be wrong but it's my gut feeling on the
subject and I trust my gut feelings. They've saved my bacon more than
once.
Paul B.
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REM1875
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Posted: March 23 2018 at 4:29pm | IP Logged Quote REM1875

Thanks Paul for your opinion on the difference between
Hercules 2400 and Alliant 2400......Most of mine is
still Hercules but I will make sure of my loads ....

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REM1875
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Posted: March 23 2018 at 4:33pm | IP Logged Quote REM1875

RT58 wrote:
Thanks STCM, That's an interesting find.

REM1875 wrote:
All our Texas Wagon Trail 44-40's
have a different grip
than the Master Chief's

I only have one, and it has the smooth Goncalo Alves
target stock the standard versions were shipped with.
I do like the magna stocks better than the targets on
a carry gun though.



Yeah thats what we have and it fills the hand
.....different than anything else I have on my few
other N-frames.

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John Van Gelder
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Posted: March 24 2018 at 6:14am | IP Logged Quote John Van Gelder

When I started as a Trooper in Alaska, we were issued mod 19 S&Ws, our ammunition was the Winchester Super X plated lead bullets, they were "HOT", you really knew you were shooting something out of those "K" frame guns.


The reason that the early .357 magnum loads were so effective is that with the high velocity and relatively soft bullets they worked great on game. If you shot very many of them at one time there was some pretty substantial leading.
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Old Ranger
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Posted: March 24 2018 at 6:48am | IP Logged Quote Old Ranger

Have not seen 2400 on a dealer's shelf in 10 years.
It's a myth.....

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RT58
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Posted: March 24 2018 at 6:59am | IP Logged Quote RT58

Unless you want to poke clean holes in something, softer beats faster.

The trade off in switching from black powder to smokeless was that soft bullets would have their rifling stripped off and cause serious leading. As a result the harder bullets didn't expand as well so the velocity was increased even more, which required even harder bullets and they were no better. Then the ammo makers pushed jacketed soft point bullets and then jacketed hollow points, which often fail to expand.

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Desert Eagle41
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Posted: March 24 2018 at 10:08am | IP Logged Quote Desert Eagle41

Interesting as I had a lot of leading issues in my Colt trouper MK III from the first soft lead bullets I shot in the new gun in the early 70"s A friend pointed out the leading and said I should shoot steel jacketed at the end of the session. I tried that and it worked so well cleaning the gun right out. I only shoot JHP now!! Craig

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